Lunch with an Abortion Doctor

I recently came across this short, intriguing story from John Ensor at PassionLife: “Lunch with an Abortion Doctor.” It raises some interesting questions that could be useful for conversations between pro-choice and pro-life friends (see below). Here’s the story:

Photo by Igor Starkov on Unsplash(Click on the image above to read “Lunch with an Abortion Doctor” by John Ensor.)

Photo by Igor Starkov on Unsplash

(Click on the image above to read “Lunch with an Abortion Doctor” by John Ensor.)

In Oradea, Romania, Mihaela and Gabby Visan run a pregnancy help center inside a women’s hospital.

Their effectiveness is severely limited by one fact: women must pay for their abortion before they can talk to anyone, committing them to abortion, even if they arrive ambivalent. So the counseling service is effectively cut out of the patient flow.

To address this, we had lunch with the main abortion doctor at the hospital. His girlfriend also joined us.

He sat down and started talking…

What Do You Think?

  • What should informed consent look like for those considering abortion?

  • Do you think it’s a good thing for pregnant mothers to see accurate imagery of the unborn (e.g. an ultrasound, in-utero footage such as content available at EHD.org, or imagery of the unborn after abortion) before making an abortion decision? Why or why not?

Online Workshop Today - 4/25

Join us today for “Taking Abortion from Debate to Dialogue,” a JFA Online Workshop with Interactive Activities. Here’s the workshop info:

Rebecca Hotovy talks with a student at a JFA outreach event at Arizona State University.

Rebecca Hotovy talks with a student at a JFA outreach event at Arizona State University.

Click here for more information about the “Taking Abortion from Debate to Dialogue” Online Workshop.

Feminism and Coffee (Instagram Link)

A quote on our Instagram page paired with two cups of coffee: “Now let’s turn to feminism. If I claim that I deserve equal rights as a woman because I am equally human to men, but then I turn around and say that I also deserve the right to end the life of someone else who is equally human to me through abortion, then I would be betraying the foundation of my feminist beliefs. So it actually makes more sense to be a pro-life feminist than it does to be a pro-choice one!” -Grace Fontenot

See the story behind this quote at “A Living Room Conversation” by former JFA staff member Grace Fontenot Read it and share your thoughts in the comments below or on our Instagram page.

COVID-19 Update from JFA

Dear Friend of JFA,

We thank God for you and are praying for you through this challenging time. Here’s an update on what’s happening with JFA in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic:

Spring Outreach Events

Mariana interacts with a student at JFA’s first-ever day of outreach at UT Dallas in early March 2020. See more pictures from this and four other recent events at our Calendar page.

Mariana interacts with a student at JFA’s first-ever day of outreach at UT Dallas in early March 2020. See more pictures from this and four other recent events at our Calendar page.

“I think that every pro lifer (and anyone who is interested or on the edge about the topic of abortion) should attend a JFA seminar. They are excellent at preparing anyone for intentional conversations.”
— Mariana, JFA Mission Trip, March 2020

We’re thanking God for the five outreach events we were able to complete in the past two months before the COVID-19 outbreak hit the US. Six mission trip participants joined our entire team as we ministered for three days at University of Texas at Dallas, and smaller teams ministered at University of North Texas, University of New Mexico, Trinity University, and University of Texas at San Antonio! See our Calendar page and social media channels for pictures.

What Outreach Is JFA Doing During the COVID-19 Outbreak?

We’re just as passionate as ever about creating productive conversations about unintended pregnancy and abortion. COVID-19 has forced us to postpone five upcoming planned outreach trips to Denver (CO), Durango (CO), Lawrence (KS), Wichita (KS), and San Diego (CA).

We’re saddened by this turn of events, but we also see this as a unique opportunity to work on an outreach project we’ve had in mind for years but to which we have not been able to give sustained attention. I’m referring to the challenge we give to audiences in virtually every presentation: “You can take what you’ve learned from us and create a conversation about abortion with someone you know.” So, every member of our training team is tackling this project while we’re forced by COVID-19 to limit our contact with people in person. We’re using social media, email, apps on our smart phones, and good old-fashioned telephone calls to engage as many people as we can in conversations one to one. Pray that we’ll learn valuable insights we can share with the people we train throughout the rest of the year. We’ll say more about this in future updates, but for now, feel free to join us by praying for one person you think may disagree with you about abortion. If you then start a conversation, let us know how it goes!

Will JFA Be Holding Any Training Events During COVID-19? Yes!

In addition, we’re experimenting with training formats which until now we haven’t needed to master: video conferencing and webinars. Susanna Dirks and I presented a webinar on March 21, and about 15 people attended. We were pleased that the participants found the event helpful. We plan to schedule more of these and will post the details at JFA’s Calendar page so you can participate. For those of you who have been waiting for JFA to come to your town for awhile, let’s talk about planning a webinar that would work for your schedule and ours! We’re excited to be able to help more people connect in this time when many are feeling extremely isolated and alone.

JFA Is Still Receiving Gifts By Mail and Online!

A JFA supporter recently asked, essentially, "Should I send my support check to a different address because of COVID-19?" We appreciated her concern for us and for making sure her gift made it to JFA, and we assured her she can definitely send her gift to the JFA office (113 N. Martinson St., Wichita, KS, 67203) with confidence that it will be received and processed. We so appreciate each of you who is continuing to give or making a new gift to JFA as you are able. (You can also give a gift online.) We understand this is a difficult time for many, and we are trusting God to sustain you and to sustain JFA.

A Word of Encouragement

Our team is focusing on trusting God through this time, and we are praying for you. We are praying for a strong immunity from this virus and that the virus would not affect your health. We are also praying for your work and your family and for a renewed sense of the peace that comes from the confidence that God is with you in Christ. This is our prayer for you, that in this time you will experience in a vivid way God’s presence with you. Thank you for praying for us as we continue our work training Christians to change hearts and save lives.

Warmly,

Steve Wagner

Executive Director

Pray for Conversations at Upcoming JFA Events

Rebekah Dyer, the newest staff member on the JFA Team, interacts with a University of Oklahoma student at the JFA Free Speech Board in early November. You can read one of her favorite conversation stories from this year here in JFA’s recent Impact R…

Rebekah Dyer, the newest staff member on the JFA Team, interacts with a University of Oklahoma student at the JFA Free Speech Board in early November. You can read one of her favorite conversation stories from this year here in JFA’s recent Impact Report.

Please pray for JFA as our team members prepare for upcoming events in Texas, New Mexico, and Kansas in the coming weeks. Pray for each person we will train and each person with whom we will converse at outreach, that God will help each to actively love every human being involved in unintended pregnancy.

  • Jan. 26 (Albion, MI): Interactive Workshop — First Baptist Church

  • Feb. 8 (Decatur, TX): Interactive Seminar — Father’s House Church

  • Feb. 9 (Denton, TX): Interactive Seminar — Redeemer Denton Church

  • Feb. 10-13 (Denton, TX): Staff Training Day and Outreach Events in North Texas

  • Feb. 17 (Albuquerque, NM): Interactive Workshop — University of New Mexico (UNM)

  • Feb. 23 (San Antonio, TX): Interactive Seminar — Trinity University (Private Event)

  • Feb. 24-25 (San Antonio, TX): University Outreach — Trinity University

  • Feb. 26-27 (San Antonio, TX): University Outreach — University of Texas at San Antonio (UTSA)

  • Mar. 3 (Wichita, KS): Presentation — St. Patrick Catholic Church

  • Mar. 7 (Richardson, TX): Interactive Seminar — University of Texas at Dallas

  • Mar. 8 (Denton, TX): Interactive Seminar — Location TBD

Featured Resource: Stephanie Gray Debate and Blog Post

We invite you to share our post referencing Stephanie Gray’s comment about belly buttons in her recent debate and in her piece, “The Greatest Love.”

Ask a friend to set aside the question of legality of abortion for a moment and engage a different set of questions: “Were we intended for abortion?” and “Or were we intended to give of ourselves and experience what it means to love?” and “Could all of us find common ground in the fact that our mothers engaged in a self-giving act of love when they gave birth to us, and could this be a light for us when we contemplate what we should do with unintended pregnancy and abortion?”

Featured Conversation Starter - Women Debate Abortion

This month, we encourage you to share with a friend the contrasting closing statements of two women in a recent debate about abortion in Mexico. After listening together to Mara Clarke and Stephanie Gray share their final thoughts, here are a couple of questions that can help you start a conversation with a friend:

  • What do you think of Mara’s and Stephanie’s statements?

  • With which one do you identify more?

No Uterus No Opinion at U of A

The woman’s sign said something like “No Uterus, No Opinion.” Executive Director Steve Wagner sat down to dialogue.

I was at the University of Arizona in November 2019, and one of the women with whom we spoke on the first day of the outreach returned on the second day…to protest. She sat down right in front of our “Should Abortion Be Made Illegal?” poll table with her own sign that said something like: “If you don’t have a uterus, you don’t have an opinion.”

I could have taken an approach of getting defensive. Or I could have dismissed her opinion by ignoring her. I could have also just given up and decided my opinion wasn't worth sharing.

Jon Wagner offered a different approach in his recent letter, “A Gracious and Courageous Response”. It’s a roadmap for responding to “You’re a man” comments, including specific examples of ways to listen, ask questions, and find common ground in order to make these conversations productive.

In my conversation with the protester in Arizona, it was a good thing I took the approach of listening and asking questions that Jon lays out in his letter. As it turned out, she did not think men shouldn’t have any opinion about abortion, and she did not think men should keep quiet about it. She meant instead, “Men shouldn’t make laws on abortion since they affect women.” This may seem like a subtle difference, but noting it helped me move the conversation in a productive direction. I’m confident Jon’s letter can help you do the same. Share it!

A Gracious and Courageous Response

How to Help a Person Who Says, “You’re a Man, So Your Opinion Doesn’t Count.”

During our outreach events and around our society, a common phrase men hear is, “Abortion is a women’s issue, so be quiet!” Or, “You don’t have a uterus, so you shouldn’t weigh in.”

Many people say that men like Steve (grey) and Jeremy (blue), pictured here at UCLA, shouldn’t even weigh in on this discussion.

These assertions silence many men. Other men react to these assertions with anger. How should we respond?

This can be frustrating, especially if the person seems dismissive or arrogant. Over the years I’ve tried to carefully consider my response, rather than getting caught up in the emotions and being defensive. I could snap back with a quick answer or cower in silence, but I strive instead to be both sensitive and substantive in my response.

The challenge is the same as with other pro-choice statements: Faithfully explain the pro-life perspective while still reaching the person. That takes empathy and humility. What an opportunity to love another person!

While passionately defending the preborn we must show genuine love for the woman who may consider abortion, and also, especially with this objection, the person who believes men shouldn’t have a voice.

This can unfold in many ways because we are trying to reach each unique person, but I believe the following progression has the best chance for ultimate success—reaching the questioner and answering the objection. As with any assertion or argument, I would encourage you to employ JFA’s “Three Essential Skills” of asking questions, listening, and finding common ground. In this case, though, the order in which you use those skills is very important for showing that you genuinely care and aren’t just trying to return fire with fire:

Listen to understand (be attentive and show them you care):

  • Listen to reflect on their statements and not primarily to refute them. Show them you are listening by making good eye contact and clarifying their statements. Listen to their heart and their hurts.

Find common ground when possible:

  • “I can’t fully understand or experience what women are going through.”

  • “I admit up front that many women have been hurt by men and many men have been unhelpful in the way they discuss this topic.”

  • “Can we agree it’s important for men to speak out against rape, abuse, and mistreatment of others?”

Ask questions (information/clarification) with a calm and genuine attitude:

  • “What do you mean when you say I shouldn’t be involved?”

  • “Do you mean I can’t hold a substantive opinion, or do you mean that I shouldn’t make laws about this?”

Ask questions (ask for evidence) with a calm and genuine attitude:

  • “Granted, I can’t fully understand what a woman in an unplanned pregnancy is experiencing, but why does that mean I can’t hold a strong opinion or involve myself in the discussion?”

  • “Why do you believe I should not take a stand?”

  • “Why would you silence me if I am trying to care for someone I believe is in need?”

Ask questions (challenge gently; notice challenging comes late in the process):

  • “How are my ideas insufficient simply because of my gender if many women make the same arguments?”

  • “There are many situations about which I don’t fully understand the circumstances, but clearly I should still help. Should I as a white man have marched in the civil rights movement or risked ridicule on Freedom Rides for the sake of people who were different from me who were being treated very harshly?”

This progression may help this person to see that her dismissal of men is an unhelpful tangent (resembling sexism) rather than a substantive argument. If so, she may then be willing to move on to discuss arguments about human rights, just as if she had been talking to a woman who had made the exact same points as you.

If not, you need to remain gracious anyway. You must continue to be both calm and confident.

I suggest using a carefully-worded story to respond to the “You’re a man!” dismissal. Consider this story from my friend and colleague Tim Brahm:

“You’re absolutely right. I am a man, and I will never get pregnant. I can do my best to sympathize with women who experience unplanned pregnancies, but I will never really know what they’re going through. Let me ask you kind of a weird question, bear with me. Imagine I go fishing at the lake. I’m having a great time fishing, and then I see her [pointing to a female pro-life volunteer] about twenty yards away. I notice that she is pushing her car into the lake. Well that’s weird, why would she do that? Then I look in the back seat, and I notice there’s a two-year-old child in the car. Now, I’m a man. I’ve never been pregnant. I’ve never been a mother. I will never know what she is going through. We could even change the scenario by making her child a newborn and saying that she has postpartum depression, something I as a man could never experience. But even though I can’t understand what she’s going through, shouldn’t I try to do something to save that kid?” (Read the rest of Tim’s helpful discussion in his November 5, 2015 post at the Equal Rights Institute blog.)

This carefully crafted story can help those with whom you disagree to realize that not only can men be advocates—they should be advocates. Why? Because the preborn are human beings like toddlers.

Psalm 82:3-4 and Proverbs 24:10-12 urge us to care for the weak. And 1 Corinthians 16:13-14 says, “Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong. Let all that you do be done in love.” (ESV)

It stands to reason that men can engage this discussion, but the point is much stronger than that — we must! Men need to abound with intentionality, empathy, support, and sound arguments clothed with grace. We have to be alert and ready to serve, a compassionate and compelling voice in all our spheres of influence.

I echo what abortion survivor, Gianna Jessen (left), said in her House Judiciary Committee hearing (9/9/15),

“Do not tell me this is only a women’s issue. It takes both a man and a woman to create a child. And to that point I wish to speak to the men listening to me. You are made for greatness. You were born to defend women and children, not to use and abandon us, nor sit idly by while you know we are being harmed, and I am asking you to be brave.”

Further Resources:

What Does a Virtuous Mother Do?

When I read my friend Stephanie Gray’s blog post, “The Greatest Love” (Nov. 18, 2019), I was struck by her behind-the-scenes look at preparing to participate in the La Ciudad de las Ideas debate which took place in Mexico in early November, reaching tens of thousands. I wanted to share the story with you.

First, I suggest watching the final few minutes of the debate (inset below). Then, read Stephanie’s post which begins below.

As you watch the debate segment and read Stephanie’s post, I encourage you to set aside for a moment the question, “How should we argue against legal abortion?” Although Stephanie is talking about a woman’s body and speaking in the context of a debate about legality, she’s not directly addressing the topic of bodily rights, per se, and her comments go deeper than legality. (For help with arguments about bodily rights and legality, see our “It’s Her Body” Series.)

Note how Stephanie’s comment in the debate appears when juxtaposed against the comments of the pro-choice panelist who speaks just prior. Stephanie cuts through the rhetoric of choice to focus the audience on the question, “What does a virtuous mother do when confronting an unintended pregnancy?” Sadly, that question is often lost or ignored. Stephanie helps recalibrate us, and her perspective might even transform the conversation. It’s worth sharing.

Without further comment from me, then, please click the video below to watch the final few minutes of the debate. (The video should begin playing at 1:55:00. If it doesn’t, move the slider to find that spot in the video or click here.)

Now that you’ve watched the video segment, read Stephanie’s post:

What would you do if, while waiting for a subway train to arrive, you noticed a seizuring man fall onto the tracks? To Wesley Autrey the answer was clear: Jump onto the tracks and help him.

And on January 2, 2007, that’s what he did. Except Autrey wasn’t just helping a man in need. He was putting himself in danger. Because as the fallen man convulsed on the tracks, the lights of an oncoming train flashed before them.

Autrey couldn’t get the man off the tracks in time. But rather than abandon him, Autrey laid on top of him, protecting the young man’s flailing body with his lanky frame. And then train cars came.…

(Keep reading the remainder of Stephanie’s blog post at the Love Unleashes Life Blog.)

More from Stephanie Gray at Love Unleashes Life

For more from Stephanie about the debate, we suggest seeing her six-minute debate highlights video and an 11-minute interview she did after the debate which gave her a chance to reflect on the debate and clarify some ideas she wasn’t able to clarify in the debate due to the format.

Thanking God for You, Grace!

Grace (center) with JFA trainer Kaitlyn Donihue (left) and veteran JFA trainer Rebecca Hotovy. (Rebecca is now working part-time behind the scenes at JFA.)

We count it a privilege to employ some of the most gifted people in the country. We also count it a privilege to serve the one true God, who is the giver of those gifts and who sustains each of our staff members in the midst of very demanding work fraught with painful realities. When God decides to guide one of our dear trainers away from our work, we are mindful of the great gift each person is who works even a day (let alone years) with us to save women and children from abortion.

Grace interacts with a student at Colorado State University in April 2018.

Recently JFA trainer Grace Fontenot sent a group of JFA supporters a letter about a transition she’s decided to make away from her work as a full-time trainer with JFA. Her letter includes highlights of her work, but I’d like to share a few additional reflections.

Grace has been a rock in our Wichita office, leading training events locally and traveling to California and Georgia and many of the states in between. In the three and a half years she’s worked full-time with JFA, I estimate she’s personally mentored over 100 pro-life volunteers through both “Seat Work” and “Feet Work” phases of our training program, given presentations to more than 1200, and personally created conversations with over 700 college students. I estimate Grace has spent over 500 hours in planes, airports, and in automobiles to show up to train pro-life Christians. She’s weathered days of outreach outdoors in 100+ degree heat and also in rain and snow. Yes, that’s right. That gumbo-cookin’, bright-smilin’ Cajun gal from Louisiana has created conversations with pro-choice advocates in the snow. As you can imagine, we are very sad to see Grace move on from her full-time work with JFA.

Grace excelled at the art of public speaking and mastered JFA content. She is a thoughtful, enthusiastic mentor of our students. She’s willing to try new things and embrace new ideas. She has a passion for women and for unborn children. She is serious about her faith, serious about doing quality work, and she’s humble when she realizes she’s made a mistake. She enjoys good ideas, good coffee, and good jokes. Grace laughs often, and she laughs heartily. We will miss Grace’s presence in our meetings and on our team.

We look forward to seeing what God will do in Grace’s life in the coming year, we pray for her ongoing discernment process for her professional life, and we look forward to seeing her join us for JFA events again as God allows it.

We thank God for Grace, and we thank Grace also for every early morning, late night, and difficult conversation she beautifully navigated with God’s help during her time with JFA. Thank you, Grace.

We also thank you for supporting Grace’s work by giving of your finances, by reading her updates, and by sharing encouraging words with her. JFA’s trainers, including Paul, Jon, Tammy, Jeremy, Susanna, Kaitlyn, and myself, will continue in 2020 to train Christians to actively love women in distress, unborn children, and those who disagree with us. We’ll continue to train Christians to create conversations that have the power to change hearts and save lives. We pray that as you reflect with Grace on the good work she’s done, that you’ll consider continuing to support the work God is doing through JFA. Thank you.